Study: 'U.S. Army officers lie' routinely

Anything not covered elsewhere

Study: 'U.S. Army officers lie' routinely

Postby Mjölnir » Sat Feb 21, 2015 3:43 pm

Article: ... index.html

Study: ... pubID=1250

So I read the article, then read the report and thought about it.

At FIRST COMMAND, I saw things that blew my mind. I saw people who shot-gunned training records to pass an inspection, a CPO who ran a security program terribly for 11 1/2 months and then went into a flail-ex for two weeks to get ready for an inspection. I was a SUB DSO and saw some of the same things but with regard to maintenance of the ship (the magical tool that you must have as part of an inventory, only 3 exist in Groton) so they are passed from boat to boat to fudge readiness.

At SECOND COMMAND, I was an Airborne DSO. Some things were different (NAVAIR is real serious about safety) but some things were the same. I eventually was a Department Head and the IG coordinator and got another lesson in integrity. Multiple divisions (DIVO's and LCPO's) who were fudging training stats, inspection stats, readiness reports ... information that skewed them to be doing their job when they really weren't.

Onboard USS THIRD COMMAND, some of the same games. I didn't let my Division or when I was the Department Head, I did my best to not let the Department play them. For months, at PB4T or schedule meetings I was always reporting substandard readiness numbers. The other Department Heads offered me advice on how to skew my numbers to not highlight myself but I kept on reporting the truth while working towards the plan I developed to get it better. For a while I wasn't overly popular, but eventually I was able to get the equipment we needed (not on loan but permanently get us our gear), training got accomplished & documented, mission was done … legitimately. The really odd thing was that people were happier in the end having their own equipment, being legitimately trained and qualified for their jobs than when things were half-assed. It took pain and hard work to get there, but the attitude of the Department shifted for the better. When the time came for our annual Fitness Reports which was about halfway through the pain / hard work phase of this I had low expectations for my FITREP since I was always dinging myself to the XO & CO. I was rated as the #1 O3 on the ship, ahead of the Surface Warfare Officers. The report was amazing and I give a lot of credit to that report for my selection from the BZ to O4. The CO made it very clear that he knew what I was doing, and that he appreciated me doing my job the right way ... despite the pain I inflicted on myself in doing it.

My basic principle was and is that I don't tolerate it stuff like this; be honest with yourself, be honest with your people, be honest with your boss. No one can fix a problem they don't know about. Be smart, know the instructions, know what is your responsibility and what is someone else's, be realistic ... a bad situation won't get fixed overnight. Use the system, make it work as intended and allow your boss to know what is going on and use the feedback loop. Did you fail an inspection because there aren't of those magic tools, or enough money to send people TAD to get required training, or hours in the day to accomplish all the CBTs in a day even if people were up for 36 straight hours.

The mentality that "well, the powers that be know all about that problem, and they're working on it or that they don't care" doesn't cut it … you need to do something about.

I get why some Army officers lie. I don't think it is ALL of them, I don't think all Navy officers lie or all of anyone in the military does. But the bottom line is that there is a point in both the enlisted and officer career paths where your career is/should be less important than doing your due diligence to your duty, future promotion be damned. When (if) you get to that point says a lot about you as a person.
  • 1

Last edited by Mjölnir on Sat May 02, 2015 2:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.
The most important six inches on the battlefield is between your ears.
User avatar
Experienced Member
Posts: 132
Joined: Thu Jul 19, 2012 2:07 am
Location: OPNAV
Reputation: 21

Re: Study: 'U.S. Army officers lie' routinely

Postby TomahawkChop » Mon Mar 02, 2015 8:15 am

Well said! Although it's more painful at the time, resisting the urge to lie and making the system work pays off in the end, although you will catch a lot of crap along the way.
  • 0

Registered Member
Posts: 42
Joined: Sun Mar 20, 2011 7:29 pm
Location: Somewhere in the USA
Reputation: 1

Re: Study: 'U.S. Army officers lie' routinely

Postby Sum1 » Mon Mar 02, 2015 8:42 am

I got a reputation for being "that" CDO onboard the ship because I wouldn't hesitate to call the XO and CO when there was something they should know about. I was a pro at dealing with oil/paint in the water, even when virtually every time it wasn't our fault (it was always pier risers leaking, old oil from ARIZONA, etc.... the paint was our fault).

The old adage "bad news doesn't get better with age" applies. Tell the truth, have a plan, and work towards your goals.

Stalwart, thank you for posting that.
  • 0

Experienced Member
Posts: 961
Joined: Wed Jun 11, 2008 1:43 am
Reputation: 15

Re: Study: 'U.S. Army officers lie' routinely

Postby Wolfpack » Wed Mar 04, 2015 10:01 pm

Have high standards, hold yourself and others to them. Do not compromise. This is not a social organization. We owe it to our people, their parents, and everyone who pays taxes.
  • 0

Experienced Member
Posts: 157
Joined: Wed Sep 15, 2010 1:14 am
Location: Wash DC
Reputation: 6

Return to Miscellaneous

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest